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  1. #81
    From Kill 'Em All to Justice is what I listen to. I kinda stopped after the Black album except Unforgiven and maybe Enter Sandman. I just couldn't get into them really any more afterwards. I guess to me they just weren't the same any more. And them kicking out Jason was the last nail in the coffin. But they are and always will be my favorite band. My favorite album is ...And Justice For All. My favorite song is Orion(can listen to it forever). RIP Cliff Burton...what could have been.

  2. #82
    And what the hell has gotten your balls in a salad shooter over this book man?

  3. #83
    The Trinity Pumpkinhead's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Robstar View Post
    I cannot impress enough how this fucking book has pissed me off!!!
    Is very common among metalheads to hate Metallica's career after the And Justice For All album, Metallica changed their style from Thrash Metal to Hard Rock and most of their early followers didn't like it and stop listening their music, taking into account that Metallica was a groundbreaking band in the metal scene.

    A the same time, changing their style is what brought Metallica more success economically speaking, so it's normal that you find that love/hate relationship in some Metallica fans

  4. #84
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    Quote Originally Posted by stone cold bruiser brody View Post
    From Kill 'Em All to Justice is what I listen to. I kinda stopped after the Black album except Unforgiven and maybe Enter Sandman. I just couldn't get into them really any more afterwards. I guess to me they just weren't the same any more. And them kicking out Jason was the last nail in the coffin. But they are and always will be my favorite band. My favorite album is ...And Justice For All. My favorite song is Orion(can listen to it forever). RIP Cliff Burton...what could have been.
    Jason left the band they didn't kicked him out, it's was the best choice since he had a lot of personal problems with James, I like their current bassist Trujillo, I think he's better than James...

  5. #85
    I never could get into Metallica, and I love metal... thrash metal specifically. I thought their sound on the albums was far too hollow and lacking crunch. If they would go back and remaster their old stuff I might get into it. Dave Mustaine did this with the old Megadeth records and they turned out really well.

    I'll say that for me, some of their stuff on their most hated albums(Load, ReLoad) are listenable for me. I listen to a lot of shit, not just metal, and if I want some more mellow metal/hard rock, some of those songs aren't bad at all. My favorite Metallica song would be Turn the Page, by far.

  6. #86
    Moderator Robstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by stone cold bruiser brody View Post
    And what the hell has gotten your balls in a salad shooter over this book man?
    This guy who wrote it, Mick Wall, he's been a rock/metal journalist of some note for a great many years. And during the first half of the book, he does a fine job doing what any biographer should and that's chronicling the bands early career while covering the major and important happenings of the band. He gives some pretty honest and forthright reviews of the music produced by the band during this time - up to and including the Black album. So, there's not much wrong there that I could find.
    It's post Black that Mick Wall really starts to systematically crucify Metallica and it's blatantly evident that he's letting his inner 'Metallihead' write this part, as if in some twisted biographical version of The Dark Half - and he really lets himself and the reader down here.
    Now I am by no means seeing things through some blind devotion to Metallica, but will unashamedly admit to being a die hard Metallica fan. I have been listening to them regular-like since 1987 and have been there through the ups and downs of their music making ever since. I've wandered in and out from time to time - I was one of the fans who fell out of sorts with Metallica during the beginnings of the direction change - eventually coming to terms with the undeniable knowledge that A) If they hadn't changed direction, they would have become obsolete and most likely expired as a band B) They had every right to explore new horizons and didn't owe it to anyone to "stay the course" as it were and C) motherfuckers gotta eat.
    So, in time I came back around and enjoyed the music for what it was. And mostly really did like it. It was right up my alley. I was one of the few who didn't mind St.Anger and I think Death Magnetic is their best album. I shit you not. It doesn't make Master Of Puppets or Black any less good but for me, on Death Magnetic, all the elements are there and in just the right doses. But again - that's just MY opinion.

    What Mick Wall fails to do here is maintain a decent amount of objectivity. Instead he uses inarguable facts in an effort to push what, to me, was clearly a personal agenda. Mick Wall didn't like Load, Reload, Garage Inc, S&M, St Anger and Death Magnetic and he has no problem letting the reader know this. The facts he uses are mostly references to sales figures, while coming across to outright scoff at markets these albums did well in. The sales cannot be denied - Load sold only half as many as the Black album, Reload half that again and so on, but holy fuck - what do you expect. As someone so succinctly puts it in the late stages of Enter Night, a music career is ups and downs - it's not a plateau. To even survive, let alone become as continually profitable for as long, is a feat in itself.
    So, I really don't feel Metallica gets a fair assessment over this part of it's career in the book. Then the guy shamelessly fawns over Metallica's collaboration with Lou Reed, because well, it's Lou Fucking Reed and he's clearly a fanboy here too. Many of the same things he nails Metallica for over their last 2 albums seem to be A-OK here, strangely.

    As for some things others have mentioned - Metallica has always been a band with domineering type-A personalities and that was a very unfortunate thing for Jason Newstead to be walking into. He never stood a chance with things like that. He felt no option but to leave since James wouldn't - couldn't - let him do other stuff musically. The strangest part is that this (Jason leaving) clearly resonated greatly with Hetfield and was a huge catalyst for pushing him to clean up. Just a shame it had to go that way.

    So that's the bee in my bonnet, the bug up my butt!

  7. #87
    The Trinity Pumpkinhead's Avatar
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    What you guys think about the Some Kind of Monster DVD??

  8. #88
    Moderator Robstar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpkinhead View Post
    What you guys think about the Some Kind of Monster DVD??
    I thought it was an awesome insight to the band and bands in general. Very courageous thing to do too. I really liked being able to see and hear some of the songs 'in utero' as they came together bit by bit.

  9. #89
    Quote Originally Posted by Robstar View Post
    This guy who wrote it, Mick Wall, he's been a rock/metal journalist of some note for a great many years. And during the first half of the book, he does a fine job doing what any biographer should and that's chronicling the bands early career while covering the major and important happenings of the band. He gives some pretty honest and forthright reviews of the music produced by the band during this time - up to and including the Black album. So, there's not much wrong there that I could find.
    It's post Black that Mick Wall really starts to systematically crucify Metallica and it's blatantly evident that he's letting his inner 'Metallihead' write this part, as if in some twisted biographical version of The Dark Half - and he really lets himself and the reader down here.
    Now I am by no means seeing things through some blind devotion to Metallica, but will unashamedly admit to being a die hard Metallica fan. I have been listening to them regular-like since 1987 and have been there through the ups and downs of their music making ever since. I've wandered in and out from time to time - I was one of the fans who fell out of sorts with Metallica during the beginnings of the direction change - eventually coming to terms with the undeniable knowledge that A) If they hadn't changed direction, they would have become obsolete and most likely expired as a band B) They had every right to explore new horizons and didn't owe it to anyone to "stay the course" as it were and C) motherfuckers gotta eat.
    So, in time I came back around and enjoyed the music for what it was. And mostly really did like it. It was right up my alley. I was one of the few who didn't mind St.Anger and I think Death Magnetic is their best album. I shit you not. It doesn't make Master Of Puppets or Black any less good but for me, on Death Magnetic, all the elements are there and in just the right doses. But again - that's just MY opinion.

    What Mick Wall fails to do here is maintain a decent amount of objectivity. Instead he uses inarguable facts in an effort to push what, to me, was clearly a personal agenda. Mick Wall didn't like Load, Reload, Garage Inc, S&M, St Anger and Death Magnetic and he has no problem letting the reader know this. The facts he uses are mostly references to sales figures, while coming across to outright scoff at markets these albums did well in. The sales cannot be denied - Load sold only half as many as the Black album, Reload half that again and so on, but holy fuck - what do you expect. As someone so succinctly puts it in the late stages of Enter Night, a music career is ups and downs - it's not a plateau. To even survive, let alone become as continually profitable for as long, is a feat in itself.
    So, I really don't feel Metallica gets a fair assessment over this part of it's career in the book. Then the guy shamelessly fawns over Metallica's collaboration with Lou Reed, because well, it's Lou Fucking Reed and he's clearly a fanboy here too. Many of the same things he nails Metallica for over their last 2 albums seem to be A-OK here, strangely.

    As for some things others have mentioned - Metallica has always been a band with domineering type-A personalities and that was a very unfortunate thing for Jason Newstead to be walking into. He never stood a chance with things like that. He felt no option but to leave since James wouldn't - couldn't - let him do other stuff musically. The strangest part is that this (Jason leaving) clearly resonated greatly with Hetfield and was a huge catalyst for pushing him to clean up. Just a shame it had to go that way.

    So that's the bee in my bonnet, the bug up my butt!
    LOL, holy shit Rob. I hope you feel better now that you got that off your chest. But I agree with you on that maybe he was a writing it being bias instead of as a professional, but being a Metallica fan since from their beginning can do that to you sometimes. So maybe you shouldn't be so hard on the fella. After all Metallica isn't no ordinary band, it's fuckin' METALLICA!
    Quote Originally Posted by Pumpkinhead View Post
    Jason left the band they didn't kicked him out, it's was the best choice since he had a lot of personal problems with James, I like their current bassist Trujillo, I think he's better than James...
    I like Trujillo too. Ever since his Suicidal Tendencies days. It's just that I think Jason or is it James, was a better fit. IMO

  10. #90
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    Quote Originally Posted by stone cold bruiser brody View Post
    LOL, holy shit Rob. I hope you feel better now that you got that off your chest. But I agree with you on that maybe he was a writing it being bias instead of as a professional, but being a Metallica fan since from their beginning can do that to you sometimes. So maybe you shouldn't be so hard on the fella. After all Metallica isn't no ordinary band, it's fuckin' METALLICA!

    I like Trujillo too. Ever since his Suicidal Tendencies days. It's just that I think Jason or is it James, was a better fit. IMO
    Jason of course, just a little mistake LOL

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