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nrb6304
01-16-2011, 10:51 PM
So I read the HHH/HHH WM match thread and thought to myself:
Hey self, you notice how HBK retired Ric Flair...then Undertaker retired HBK....what'd that do for them?

Like what did retiring Ric Flair add to HBK's career that he couldn't have lived without? Sure I understand the whole "to let anybody lesser do it would detriment Ric Flair's legacy." But that's bullsh*t. Ric Flair would've been a legend and a HOF'er either way whether it was HBK or Randy Orton.

Same thing for HBK, what did it do for UT to retire HBK? Nothing. Not a damn thing.

Now that I think about it Steve Austin let Rock retire him, and then Rock up and left.

So how come they didn't let a younger guy be the one to retire them? Pass the torch literally? I mean, idk...makes you think.

Infact the ONLY guy to actually "pass the torch" IMO was Mick Foley, Foley "retired" in 2000 with Triple H, when he could've easily said "aw hell let me and Funk have one last great match." But instead he passed the torch to the guy HE KNEW was gonna carry the company in Triple H. Then he comes back 4 years later and takes the fall to Randy Orton and Batista at WM XX.

So my question is, why do YOU think HBK and Ric Flair chose who they chose to retire them instead of some up and comer. BESIDES the whole "one last great match"??

SilverGhost
01-16-2011, 10:53 PM
They wanna go into retirement looking good in a match rather than passing the torch.

straightedge916
01-17-2011, 12:04 AM
im sure in the title you mean HHH/HBK WM 27 right?

CMhuw24
01-17-2011, 12:31 AM
Well considering its their last match with the company, and after the decades of work both of them put in i beleive they deservse to choose their last match.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 12:58 AM
In my opinion, there was only 4 wrestlers in the WWE locker room at the time that truly deserved to end Ric Flair's career.

1. Shawn Michaels
2. Triple H
3. Chris Jericho
4. The Undertaker

Neither of them need that in their resume to be legends... but that's how it is. When you "pass the torch" you pass it to someone that deserves it. I don't think that any of the new talents deserves that kind of honor.

I compare modern wrestling with modern music. The real talent is underground, there are a few truly talented artists in the mainstream but that certainly is not the rule.

SilverGhost
01-17-2011, 01:05 AM
In my opinion, there was only 4 wrestlers in the WWE locker room at the time that truly deserved to end Ric Flair's career.

1. Shawn Michaels
2. Triple H
3. Chris Jericho
4. The Undertaker

Neither of them need that in their resume to be legends... but that's how it is. When you "pass the torch" you pass it to someone that deserves it. I don't think that any of the new talents deserves that kind of honor.

I compare modern wrestling with modern music. The real talent is underground, there are a few truly talented artists in the mainstream but that certainly is not the rule.

I think there are a few who does.

Only 2 names that come to my mind, Sheamus and Wade Barrett.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 01:29 AM
They are in the right path, but saying they deserved something like that... I think is premature.

The Brown One
01-17-2011, 01:38 AM
I think there are a few who does.

Only 2 names that come to my mind, Sheamus and Wade Barrett.

I love Sheamus. But I think that even he isn't fit to end the career of Ric Flair(if Sheamus was active in WWE then). Hes good, but not worth facing Flair, and being his last opponent in wrestling, ever(well that would be true, but Flair chose to wrestle occasionally again). If anyone should have retired Flair, its the guys that jcagosto mentioned. A legend deserves to choose his final opponent, and it should be another legend, so it makes the defeat not seem so bad, because it was done by a legend.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 01:46 AM
Im just saying that people like Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Triple H, Chris Jericho and Undertaker are part of a dying breed. This guys are at the top of the food chain. Well maybe there are some guys that indeed deserve the honor to end the career of one of this legends. But not a single "new guy" comes to my mind. Names that come to my mind... well:

CM Punk
Randy Orton
John Cena

Randy Orton and John Cena don't really need this. Maybe CM Punk do need it. He is by far the best of the three in my opinion. But the new guys... MEh! The Miz and Sheamus are the two guys that are the closer to this point.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 01:50 AM
BTW, I'm not even taking Edge into consideration because he apparently wants to retire soon, so there's no use to "pass the torch" to him.. But at some point he was the perfect choice to retire Undertaker. This two guys have good chemistry on the ring and Edge's career has been great too.

CMhuw24
01-17-2011, 02:51 AM
Im just saying that people like Shawn Michaels, Ric Flair, Triple H, Chris Jericho and Undertaker are part of a dying breed. This guys are at the top of the food chain. Well maybe there are some guys that indeed deserve the honor to end the career of one of this legends. But not a single "new guy" comes to my mind. Names that come to my mind... well:

CM Punk
Randy Orton
John Cena

Randy Orton and John Cena don't really need this. Maybe CM Punk do need it. He is by far the best of the three in my opinion. But the new guys... MEh! The Miz and Sheamus are the two guys that are the closer to this point.

I beleive if Jericho was still in WWE he would also be an option.

Rated_R(ob)KO
01-17-2011, 03:26 AM
They put the time in. They should choose who puts 'em out. Point blank. Screw a proverbial "torch". That's truthfully only done when an "era" shifts. Or when they're forced to. And technically.... TECHNIACLLY, Stone Cold may have been retired by The Rock BUT he passed the torch to Cena. And that was with a beer can at HoF. THAT was legitimate. THAT is how passig the torch is done lol.

Kashdinero
01-17-2011, 03:58 AM
While it's nice to have one last great match, it's nicer to put a guy over who could benefit from such a momentous victory. Bragging rights do wonders for a guys career, just ask Jericho!

Regardless of wether there aren't many in the company at the time that deserve it, a star the magnitude of HBK or Flair should put a younger guy over in their last match. HBK & Flairs retirement matches were wasted opportunities as far as I'm concerned.

Of course both Ric & Shawn have given (and taken) so much from the business, that they have the right to dictate how they leave it (or not, as it were,in Flairs (not so unique) case). I just think it wouldn't have tarnished their reputation's by "doing the right thing"!

alexrules01
01-17-2011, 04:17 AM
They should put younger guys over before there last match, then be able to choose who they want as there 'last' opponent. Its just respect for what they have done for the business.
If it was Ric Flair vs an up-and comer in 2008 (Mr Kennedy, MVP, Umaga spring to mind) the match doesn't seem as great, it takes away from there legacy

The Brown One
01-17-2011, 05:57 AM
Flair should have put more young people over, before he retired, but not in his retirement match, which IMO should be against a legend. From what I remember, Flair kept beating wrestlers for the 2 months before he retired, and it was part of the storyline from Vince's words "If you lose a match, your'e retired". That wasn't fair to Ric(even though it was just a storyline), and to the up and comers. He should have helped the future of the wrestling business.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 09:46 AM
I beleive if Jericho was still in WWE he would also be an option.

Read my first post.

jcagosto
01-17-2011, 10:06 AM
Triple H really doesn't need to put over anybody, but I think he will anyways. Since he is probably the one that's gonna be running business when VKM is no longer around, he will benefit of it in the long run.

I think he should put over John Morrison the same way he did with Jeff Hardy. They can plant the seed with the fact that probably Triple H will want to return and look for retribution against Sheamus, but John Morrison wants to take him out himself. They can even create some triple threat matches in the process, building up the tension. Sheamus playing the role of the smart heel that wants this to guys destroy each other. I don't know they have a lot possibilities...

ihearvoices
01-17-2011, 01:25 PM
I all for putting over up and comers but not in your last match. i mean i dont really See any up and comers on HHH level enough to give him the send off match he deserves. its more then just in ring skills. its everything (mic skills,in ring skills, the build up, the name) like when we heard it was going to be hbk vs flair we knew it was going to be a match to remember or when we heard it was going to be taker vs hbk just off the names of these wrestlers we expected nothing but the best and at least for me that what i got. At the end of the day i think the point is to put over up and comers before you're about to retire not wait til your last match to say hey now im ready to be a team player thats just point less.

SaberToothTigerz
01-17-2011, 01:31 PM
they did it for the money
obvious reason
a match at mania between two icons always draws huge on paper and never dissapoints

ihearvoices
01-17-2011, 01:34 PM
Plus one thing HHH has is pride and we all know he loves to be that guy. So i highly doubt at the end of his career he would want to look out for others by using his last match to put over a new person it just not in him. Really i dont see it happening he would want it to be someone like Y2J or Taker because losing to them wont hurt his legacy. plus you all know if HHH was to lose to someone like Swagger or Sheamus tomorrow and retire you guys would be on here bitching how he lost to someone like them. my final thought is if you as a wrestler haven't Headline atleast 5 WMs then you dont deserve to be the guy to take out the game HHH.

ihearvoices
01-17-2011, 01:36 PM
they did it for the money
obvious reason
a match at mania between two icons always draws huge on paper and never dissapoints
You're so Right also I believe Vince wants to Bring the Miz on that John Cena level you can see it. The miz has what it takes to be that guy and more. So if HHH is going to use his last match to put over someone i rather it be The miz like i have said many other times.

el gabo
01-17-2011, 01:40 PM
People forget that even though legends have a say in their booking, ultimately it's up to Vince to decide what's gonna be done. HBK vs Undertaker=$$$$$$$$$$$$$

ihearvoices
01-17-2011, 01:51 PM
People forget that even though legends have a say in their booking, ultimately it's up to Vince to decide what's gonna be done. HBK vs Undertaker=$$$$$$$$$$$$$

You have a point but now i have a question Who Could Draw money Wrestling in a match against HHH in his last match at WM? i only see 2 people
1. John Cena - but they wont use him because his to popular with the fans and the fans love HHH
2. taker - It could happen because either way fans will still like taker plus with taker being the man who took out hhh best friend it could work out very easy.

But let me know who you guys think could go Against HHH in his last match and Draw in money.

CobraNightviper
01-17-2011, 02:53 PM
passing the torch seems to be dead right now may be it's just a diffrent time in wrestling look how much wrestling has changed over the years just like the world but who knows it might be cool to pass the torch in a match again like Andre did to hogan elect some day.