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View Full Version : Is WWE becoming what WCW eventually turned into?



Keith Stone
06-15-2012, 02:29 AM
I've noticed how WWE is growing very similar to the WCW I used to watch that went to hell from 1999 to 2001. here's a few things that I've noticed

1. The gap between established guys and the new guys (both due to releasing or not pushing enough new guys from 1994 to 1999 for WCW and from 2004 to 2010 for WWE)

2. the new guys and some older guys in WCW had alot of dumb gimmicks like WWE is doing now WCW: the artist formerly known as prince, some magician wrestler, Mike Awesome as a 70's guy, Tank Abbott (MMA guy that Couldn't even wrestle), 3 count, etc lol
WWE: Brodus Clay, Ryback, Lord Tensai, the one man rock band lol

3. The most popular guy is made into a joke WCW: Goldberg WWE: John Cena. only difference is WCW did the dumbest thing they could do and make Goldberg heel

4. Relies on too many old talent either past their prime or not full time with the company and never get the new guys over enough.
WCW: Hogan, Nash, Macho Man, Ric Flair
WWE: HHH (the savior), The Undertaker,The Rock, Brock, HBK, The Big Show, Mr. McMahon

5. shove a boring heel into the fans thoats and try to convince you he's the biggest heel ever.
WCW: Jeff Jarrett WWE: Alberto Del Rio

6. Too many pointless ppvs with dumb matches
WCW: most of them WWE: Extreme Rules, TLC, HIAC
WCW: _______ on a pole match WWE: having job matches on a 65 dollar ppv.

7. A lot of underused talent and less wrestling

What's everybody else think?

kcg87
06-15-2012, 03:08 AM
the reason WcW went out of business is because time warner sold it to Vince so i dont think Vince is selling the WWE anytime soon.

Jerichoholic-NL
06-15-2012, 03:18 AM
1. Agree
2. most of them, i still like Ryback, but might change
3. agreed, people still boo him
4. this is the result of 1. , but you have to agree that they are more entertaining than the whole roster of now
5. agreed, and cool comparison
6. Totally agreed man, i hate Hell in a Cell PPV the most. Some are still decent like Chamber and MITB
7. That will always happen, but still agree

K-Jammin
06-15-2012, 03:54 AM
I genuinely think that if their wasn't such a backlash to David Arquette winning the WCW title all those years ago, then Vince would have done something similar by now.

But luckily, I don't think WWE are quite as bad as WCW were in late 2000. WWE still puts on great matches for ( most of ) their PPV's. WCW would have Kevin Nash Vs Scott Steiner or Lex Luger Vs DDP headlining PPV's, which sucked. All interesting characters ( apart from Luger ) but really couldn't put on a great match.

I totally agree about Jarrett. Vince Russo pushed him to the fucking moon and he still never sold a ticket.

Goldberg always sucked IMO, but this is coming from a guy who was a Buff Bagwell fan. :o

Keith Stone
06-15-2012, 05:16 AM
I totally agree about Jarrett. Vince Russo pushed him to the fucking moon and he still never sold a ticket.

Jeff Jarrett's the reason why I quit watching WCW lol I never understood putting the WCW world title on a guy who's was on the mid card in WWF getting his ass beat by Chyna. Also I remember getting into fights with random people just because they actually bought a Slap Nuts T shit lol

Tommy Thunder
06-15-2012, 05:37 AM
I've noticed how WWE is growing very similar to the WCW I used to watch that went to hell from 1999 to 2001. here's a few things that I've noticed

1. The gap between established guys and the new guys (both due to releasing or not pushing enough new guys from 1994 to 1999 for WCW and from 2004 to 2010 for WWE)

Agreed. There does seem to be a gap between the established talent and the newer guys. However, I feel that WWE is plugging that gap slowly. We've seen Wade Barrett step up to main event, Cody Rhodes is on his way, Dolph Ziggler's on his way, Sheamus has stepped up. But on the other hand, now that these guys are becoming main eventers, there's now a gap behind them. The next wave of main event talent should be mid card around the mid card titles, but on one hand we have Christian holding the IC title (but I think he'll put over a young guy when he drops it), and the US title is strapped to the waist of a joke character. Pathetic really.


2. the new guys and some older guys in WCW had alot of dumb gimmicks like WWE is doing now WCW: the artist formerly known as prince, some magician wrestler, Mike Awesome as a 70's guy, Tank Abbott (MMA guy that Couldn't even wrestle), 3 count, etc lol
WWE: Brodus Clay, Ryback, Lord Tensai, the one man rock band lol

I like the Ryback character. I'm not sure if you'd call it a gimmick, since I'm not sure exactly what you'd call the gimmick (having a streak is not a gimmick, a gimmick is a character). If done right Ryback will be a hit.
Clay, well, it's been done before with Ernst Miller, and now we've got a fat guy doing it. He's never going to be anything more than a sideshow with that gimmick.
With Tensai, it's WWE's fault for not treating it correctly. This could have worked with the right treatment, but WWE really did mess it up IMO.


3. The most popular guy is made into a joke WCW: Goldberg WWE: John Cena. only difference is WCW did the dumbest thing they could do and make Goldberg heel

Yeah, I think we all agree on this lol!


4. Relies on too many old talent either past their prime or not full time with the company and never get the new guys over enough.
WCW: Hogan, Nash, Macho Man, Ric Flair
WWE: HHH (the savior), The Undertaker,The Rock, Brock, HBK, The Big Show, Mr. McMahon

I disagree here. I don't think WWE rely as heavy on the guys you named as much as WCW did.
They rely on Taker to sell one ppv per year; Wrestlemania. Nothing else. They barely even mention him for the rest of the year. HBK, when's the last time he made an appearance? He makes a handful of appearances per year, and that's about it.
The Rock is similar. Given, I think if it were possible, WWE would have him appear more I'm sure, but they can't, so he doesn't.
With Brock Lesnar, it's a one off one year deal. It's a chance they couldn't turn down since they likely won't get the same chance again. He's bringing in ratings and money, so it's a smart move.
Mr McMahon, again only makes a handful of appearances per year. This past Monday was the first time we've seen him since November last year I think. And let's be honest, look at what it did to the ratings!

Having said all of this, there are still young new faces at the forefront of feuds. We have Punk and Bryan in the WWE title picture, Dolph Ziggler and Sheamus in the WHC picture, Rhodes battling with a vet in Christian for the IC title, young new tag teams forming (like Young/O'Neill and Kidd/Gabriel) that could eventually lead to a resurgence in the division. There's plenty going on beyond the veterans that are being featured.


5. shove a boring heel into the fans thoats and try to convince you he's the biggest heel ever.
WCW: Jeff Jarrett WWE: Alberto Del Rio

Agreed. We have ruined ADR by using this tactic. And because of it, everybody hates him for all the wrong reasons now.


6. Too many pointless ppvs with dumb matches
WCW: most of them WWE: Extreme Rules, TLC, HIAC
WCW: _______ on a pole match WWE: having job matches on a 65 dollar ppv.

I'm not as pissed about the gimmick ppv's as others are. I end up enjoying them most of the time.
But I 100% agree on the squash matches. I mean I can't understand why you'd put matches of that nature on a ppv card when you could have used the time to put on a tag team title match or something.
I recall one ppv recently having a Clay squash AND a Ryback squash match on it. Ridiculous.


7. A lot of underused talent and less wrestling

While I think the amount of wrestling per show is improving recently (the last episode of Smackdown was very wrestling heavy), I do think it could be better. With raw going to 3 hours, then perhaps it'll get better.
But I again 100% agree that there's far too many talents underused, mostly 'smaller' guys. Tyson Kidd, Hunico (who, IMO, WWE have decided to make their new Chavo Guerrero), Joe Henning I could go on all day. These guys need to be featured more since they are entertaining to watch.

A good post btw. Perhaps you should write a blog on this, make a real feature out of the topic.

K-Jammin
06-15-2012, 05:40 AM
Jeff Jarrett's the reason why I quit watching WCW lol I never understood putting the WCW world title on a guy who's was on the mid card in WWF getting his ass beat by Chyna. Also I remember getting into fights with random people just because they actually bought a Slap Nuts T shit lol

Haha yeah those slap nuts T-shirts sucked!

Lowki
06-15-2012, 07:16 AM
1. The gap between established guys and the new guys (both due to releasing or not pushing enough new guys from 1994 to 1999 for WCW and from 2004 to 2010 for WWE)
Hate to tell you, but WWE has always had that gap. Attitude Era; Stone Cold, Mankind, The Rock, Undertaker, Kane, Big Show were pretty much the main event scene.
Today; Cena, Orton, Sheamus, Punk, Bryan, Show, Del Rio.
If anything, Younger talent are being pushed a hell of a lot more.

2. the new guys and some older guys in WCW had alot of dumb gimmicks like WWE is doing now WCW: the artist formerly known as prince, some magician wrestler, Mike Awesome as a 70's guy, Tank Abbott (MMA guy that Couldn't even wrestle), 3 count, etc lol
WWE: Brodus Clay, Ryback, Lord Tensai, the one man rock band lol
They have always had periods of awful gimmicks; 1995 - Aldo Montoya, Doink, Isaac Yankem, Dean Douglas, Waylon Marcy, Henry Godwinn, Mantaur..
3. The most popular guy is made into a joke WCW: Goldberg WWE: John Cena. only difference is WCW did the dumbest thing they could do and make Goldberg heel
It's not about one main guy, it's about the product as a whole. WCW just made 0 sense at the end.

4. Relies on too many old talent either past their prime or not full time with the company and never get the new guys over enough.
WCW: Hogan, Nash, Macho Man, Ric Flair
WWE: HHH (the savior), The Undertaker,The Rock, Brock, HBK, The Big Show, Mr. McMahon
How do they rely on these guys when they appear like 3 times a year? Before last monday, McMahon last appeared about a year ago. The Rock, fair enough he had a feud for most of last year with John Cena but The rock has JUST turned 30. Undertaker was 40 in 2004/2005! He was the main guy back then. HHH again, appears now and again. These part timers are rarely in title matches either. Besides the Big Show, i think the Undertaker was the last person to win a main title back in 2010?

The only ACTIVE wrestler on this list is the big show. New guys never get over enough? Punk, Sheamus and Bryan say hi. These three get pretty big pops most of the time and Bryan's a freaking heel. When you watch WWE today, the main event scene is usually none of these names you mentioned. The Big Show is getting a renewed push and isn't doing too bad atm.

5. shove a boring heel into the fans thoats and try to convince you he's the biggest heel ever.
WCW: Jeff Jarrett WWE: Alberto Del Rio
Difference; Jarrett was the MAIN heel. Del Rio, isn't. Don't all companies try and convince you someone is the biggest heel ever though? I mean, aren't TNA doing this with Kaz and Daniels right now? All companies want to push certain guys.

6. Too many pointless ppvs with dumb matches
WCW: most of them WWE: Extreme Rules, TLC, HIAC
WCW: _______ on a pole match WWE: having job matches on a 65 dollar ppv.
Pointless PPVs that STILL sell pretty well and don't really cause any concern in the buy rates.

7. A lot of underused talent and less wrestling
This period has 100 times more wrestling than the great Attitude era. Every era has underused talent, that's a nonsensical comment. I'm sorry, but if you watched WCW until the end, you will know that this is nowhere near that bad. One problem with WCW was their future talent grew restless and were poached by WWE - Radicalz, Jericho for example. It's not just WWE that's declined. All wrestling is on the down slide because it's ALL gotten stale these days. wrestling was big back in the day because there were 3 major companies battling for competition, which drove up ratings. WWE started getting edgier due to WCW, but ECW also promoted the other two to increase the level of violence slightly due to it's growing popularity. However, there's nothing like that to prompt WWE to panic. The rivalry with TNA is comparable to the attitude era being WWE vs ECW, if WCW hadn't existed. (TNAs ratings are very close to this).

Nothing alike.

The Hipster
06-15-2012, 08:05 AM
1. The gap between established guys and the new guys (both due to releasing or not pushing enough new guys from 1994 to 1999 for WCW and from 2004 to 2010 for WWE)

Agreed, but they are working on this.

2. The gimmick comparison is a little off. Most, if not all wrestlers, have gimmicks, some are just more outlandish than others. I think in the WWE's case, they don't have too many that are over the top.

3. The most popular guy is made into a joke WCW: Goldberg WWE: John Cena. only difference is WCW did the dumbest thing they could do and make Goldberg heel - I'm split on this point. Is Cena being made a joke, or is he being moved out of the title picture but kept relevant?

4. Relies on too many old talent either past their prime or not full time with the company and never get the new guys over enough.
WCW: Hogan, Nash, Macho Man, Ric Flair
WWE: HHH (the savior), The Undertaker,The Rock, Brock, HBK, The Big Show, Mr. McMahon

I disagree on this point. The WWE doesn't rely on these guys. Most of them are brought in just to get a big pop. The Rock/Cena story went wat too long, Taker only shows at Mania, Vince just returned after some time and will be gone again. HHH & Show are reallt the only ones here and Show is an activ wrestler.

5. A MILLION times Yes

6. Too many pointless ppvs with dumb matches
WCW: most of them WWE: Extreme Rules, TLC, HIAC
WCW: _______ on a pole match WWE: having job matches on a 65 dollar ppv.

7. A lot of underused talent and less wrestling - I agree, but again they are starting to push the youngsters.

What's everybody else think?

Cabers
06-15-2012, 01:17 PM
First off wow! Yeah i hadn't really noticed myself but your completely right the only thing left to do is have David Arquette win MitB and become the WWE Champion.

Wrestling Realist
06-15-2012, 02:59 PM
I'm glad I'm not the only one who see this the similarities between the two, but at least the wwe corporation want wwe around unlike AOL Time Warner who always hated on WcW. Also WWE keep rewriting scripts up in till show time and some times even as the show is going on, just like WcW did back in the day. Another thing that is funny is Johnny Ace was a top executive at WcW at the end and Now is one at WWE

Y2JLionsault
06-15-2012, 11:34 PM
Honestly the WWE could turn into whatever they want. The real downfall only happened because the WWE were around. You may be right and the WWE may be heading in that direction but until they have proper competition they will remain relevant no matter how stupid or ridiculous it does get. More to the point I don't think the WWE is heading down that path to the level WCW did.

HCollins-TNA1
06-16-2012, 12:19 AM
I've noticed how WWE is growing very similar to the WCW I used to watch that went to hell from 1999 to 2001. here's a few things that I've noticed

1. The gap between established guys and the new guys (both due to releasing or not pushing enough new guys from 1994 to 1999 for WCW and from 2004 to 2010 for WWE)

2. the new guys and some older guys in WCW had alot of dumb gimmicks like WWE is doing now WCW: the artist formerly known as prince, some magician wrestler, Mike Awesome as a 70's guy, Tank Abbott (MMA guy that Couldn't even wrestle), 3 count, etc lol
WWE: Brodus Clay, Ryback, Lord Tensai, the one man rock band lol

3. The most popular guy is made into a joke WCW: Goldberg WWE: John Cena. only difference is WCW did the dumbest thing they could do and make Goldberg heel

4. Relies on too many old talent either past their prime or not full time with the company and never get the new guys over enough.
WCW: Hogan, Nash, Macho Man, Ric Flair
WWE: HHH (the savior), The Undertaker,The Rock, Brock, HBK, The Big Show, Mr. McMahon

5. shove a boring heel into the fans thoats and try to convince you he's the biggest heel ever.
WCW: Jeff Jarrett WWE: Alberto Del Rio

6. Too many pointless ppvs with dumb matches
WCW: most of them WWE: Extreme Rules, TLC, HIAC
WCW: _______ on a pole match WWE: having job matches on a 65 dollar ppv.

7. A lot of underused talent and less wrestling

What's everybody else think?

1. Yes and no.... You always have to keep a fresh rotation of guys to fill spots... WCW relied on the Power Plant and WWE has FCW/NXT.... WCW had a mix of old and new guys getting pushes.... take Booker T who was one of the most popular in the later days of WCW for example...

2. Gimmicks has always been in wrestling dumb or not.... WWE has always had it share of dumb gimmicks that didn't work... But WCW seemed to had more...

3. Funny comparison.... As Goldberg and Cena does and do have many similarities... LOL.... But I feel DDP was more popular then Goldberg or was pushed more...

4. see answer #1 it always been a mix WCW had the Millionares Club and New Blood and Natural Born Thillers and many forms of the NWO(LOL)... Russo ran Hogan out of WCW and had him sitting at home, Savage only worked one time under Russo and Bischoff, Nash worked no matter what, then Flair just always needed to money for the ex's.. As for WWE right now most only appear 1 or 2 maybe 3 or 4 times a year..

5. It was more less a mix of heels who was pushed in WCW besides, Double J, there was also Scott Stenier, the Natural Born Thrillers namely Mike Sanders who no more the then a jobber in a Main Event role..

6. Gimmick matches has always been around.... It just that some can sale if booked right and some just don't sale.... funny thing is WCW never had one PPV dedicated to Pole matches although it could had been interesting..

7. same thing in 1 and 4 it more less a rotation.... some guys get booked better some gets nothing... More the less WCW had 5 hours of TV at last with Nitro, Thunder and WCW World Wide Nitro and thunder was mostly used for main Eventers, World wide you might had a champion or champions but it was used to push undercard... Now the WWE has 4 shows or 6 hours or 7 including Raw AM, Raw and Smackdown- mostly main Eventers or upper card guys, Superstars-mid card and maybe a upper card guy every once in while, NXT- just the up and comers...